TacDom 16/07/10

[Cent~SPARTA~]

Missed the 1st on OA maps lol, lucking forward to tonight.

 

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

Tacdom will be with the cqbf domination

 

no scoped weapons except

 

Alpha Sniper (M110 TWS)

bravo, charlie and echo snipers m4s with acogs

everyone else has access to iron sights and red dots

 

Snipers do not lose your scoped weapons there are none to be had in the box.

 

Dipsersion mod is on.

 

The idea is to get close fast and fight at close quarters

 

TWS sniper will provide overwatch with a spotter. This should go to the best recon player, should not engage but should warn squads of approaching danger and engage if called upon by commander

 

We can use vehicles to punch into cover (humvees and land rovers)

 

The apache can be used to cover route to AO but must not engage AO

 

Armour in AO has been reduced

 

Charlie and Echo squads are undercover units

[Batwing~SPARTA~]

I will be home around 6.30 EST but i would love to be part of this!

 

Do you think it will be active at that time ?

 

PM me if I need any password to get on TS channels or Server, thx a lot

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

This sounds awesome. I hope I can attend today. Just curious by what you mean by "undercover." Are those squads actually soldiers disguised as civillians? That could be awesome, and something I suggested on the armaholic site.

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

They are US delta force undercover operatives dressed and armed in takistani gear (except for the marksmen, that have M4 acogs) , I dont know if they can penetrate an AO but Ithought it would be cool to try them.

 

We also have a takistani Huey and an AN2.

 

I dont know batwing it goes on as long as people are up for it.

 

BTW it will be in veteran mode as well, no enemy markers

[Cent~SPARTA~]

Sounds awesome. whats the mode of InFill. Air or Land?.

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

Sounds awesome. whats the mode of InFill. Air or Land?.

 

I'm guessing it will depend on the AO and the terrain.

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

The undercover guys can approach the AO quite close, but cannot be revived or healed, WE walked in as a squad and got within 10 metres of an enemy before receiving fire from another enemy

[Cent~SPARTA~]

The undercover guys can approach the AO quite close, but cannot be revived or healed, WE walked in as a squad and got within 10 metres of an enemy before receiving fire from another enemy

Lol it was good to watch as a squad of 5 just sauntered up the valley road.

[OrcFace_McStompYou]

The undercover guys can approach the AO quite close, but cannot be revived or healed, WE walked in as a squad and got within 10 metres of an enemy before receiving fire from another enemy

 

Can not be healed/revived ever or is it just that healing/reviving breaks their cover?

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

Fairly good couple of games, although there seemed to be quite a bit of waiting. Sorry for voicing the frustraition, and then I had to leave early due to the family. Fridays just aren't turning out to be good TacDom days for me anymore.

[Halli~SPARTA~]

Ok Lets hear what ya'll think about this set up....sorry I get home after prime time.

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

They cannot be healed revived at all. After a bit of frustration the six of us that were left tried a few things out, We tried to laloto the centre of town in using the Air Tak An2 passenger bi plane. Plane stalled pulling a 0.6g turn and augered in, but were in spirits from flying in this relic. Switched to a chinook and tried again, got shot down, switched to a Huey made it in but were mostly shot out of our shoots. Then tried the under cover approach, We walked into town like an AI patrol, guns down, in a single file column it an already active AO. It needs some more testing but it was a bit of fun. I enjoyed the FAL.

 

I would modify this to include optics (acogs and such) but no more sniper rifles ,make the AN2 respawn, reduce the undercover units to one squad.

 

People should note that as a rule tacdom (and indeed tactical missions) are in veteran mode so there are no enemy markers. It is much harder but that is how it is played.

 

Thanks for your patience.

[Luggage~SPARTA~]

I enjoyed last night with the close up. The M60 is required, at least one in each squad. If you are going to suppress you need some heavy auto fire laying into the AI to keep their heads down.

 

Smoke was excellent Zeno, and best use of it was made. I think we need to be a tad nearer to the enemy when we engage though. With the lack of scoped weapons within the squads it make some targets appear a little out of our range.

 

Would like to refine and keep trying that mode of play.

 

cheers

[Batwing~SPARTA~]

Hi Guys,

 

First of all I want to apologize for my behaviour yesterday.

 

I had a quite tough day at the office, came back home with a thick headache and I was hoping to be able to enjoy the game.

Unfortunately the massive headache made me very irritable and when I started the game I got into a couple of glitches (I guess) killing my enthusiasm.

 

First thing, I didn t know when I parachute I cannot land on the side of a hill. I planned my landing carefully to be protected by the hill slope and as a result as soon as I touch down I died for misterious damages - This sucks... It was a glitch or is an insane rule of this game ?

 

Second, respawn, finally manage to land on perfect flat terrain (no more slopes) but got it a bit far away from where Delta 1 was suppose to provide fire support from above, so already frustrated for that... trying to reach myy location here it comes a nice T-52...

 

Strangely i was opening my Map to see where my location was to go to my deployment, and I was not able to see myself on the map. Is that another glitch or is something related to the Veteran mode?

 

Anyway, I quickly dive behind a rock, good cover and think, no problem, I have my MAAW, I m gonna annihilate that guy right away...

Forgot something else I consider a glitch, having my rocket launcher in my backpack, switching to it, my character decided to STAND UP IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE, losing cover, to get the freeking rocket launcher form the backpack...... I wanna know who in the hell designed this behaviour, like I would not be able to get the stuff from backpack at least crouched.. I don t need to fully stand up for that!!

 

Lol, anyway, of course as soon as i came out from behind the rock, the tank machinegunner made me more similar to an Hemmental Swisse cheese, love those holes ;)

 

So, after 2 glitches in a row and my massive headache, I decided to screw the game before I was throwing the PC out the window

And i left...

 

Apologies to my team mate, next time will be better, at least without headache

Edited July 17, 2010 by Batwing

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

Now worries,

 

In veteren mode you cannot see enemy markers or your own (unless you turn on player markers, which we all do). Arma sometime makes you stand up even when you switch to an m107.

 

I am looking into putting back scoped weapons but no snipers, to bring the engagement range down.

 

I have some ideas.

 

I have been playing around with the undercover guy and he can penetrate the AO without triggering it sometimes. I think he needs to stay on the road. I will experiment some more.

[Batwing~SPARTA~]

Well,

 

If you are thinking to put scopes back, I would love to have the Mk16 with GL and ACOG, which allows to switch to the CQB optic.

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

It's one flaw from playing in recruit mode all week and then going to vet mode, it can take some adjustment, but you should be cool after that.

 

I may be in the minority here, but my personal opinion is that on these cqb maps, armor should be taken out completely. They are fun to shoot, but a plan goes much more smoothly and a team moves much better when that is not a worry. AT guys tend to stray away from the pack I've noticed when in an engagement, then get themselves or the teammate they left killed. It's no fault of their own, since they gotta act quickly. I just think plans would run more smoothly in an all-infantry AO.

 

I would recommend keeping the number of ACOGs down, like the sniper rifles. Keep a few, but if everyone has them, you won't see an engagement closer than 300m. I also believe iron sights on many of the weapons suck in-game, and restrict the player more. In RL, a shooter would have both eyes open and wouldn't have to worry about the sights taking up half his sight picture. Just a thought. The red-dot sights are just enough to keep engagement ranges between 0-300m. One issue to think about, though, is that if everyone is taking different weapons with different scopes, they will naturally not move as a single unit during an engagement and will get spread out or left behind under fire.

 

One undercover squad of about 4max (Delta) would work out great.

 

CQB brings more challenge into getting in the AO, and I've already seen a couple intense firefights, which is great. It really takes a different strategy in all aspects to get the job done. I'm hoping that next time I get to play, we get to operate away from the base with minimal re-supply and quicker organization.

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

A few thoughts

 

stock arma server is in regular mode, not recruit mode, lol.

 

Enemies dont wait until we are within 300 metres, they start engaging at 500+, I have to modify the dispersion mod pbo to reduce their probability of spotting at distance

 

We can take out all armour, this may still leave some armored cars and armed landrovers etc

 

if we dont have scopes I think the best weapons are m32, a saw with tracer and then anything for up close, FAL with iron sights is effective, but probably any 7.62 is good enough

 

The squad make up is vital with several machine gunners and grenadiers

 

Because the undercover guy cannot be revived I dropped the squads to one man. I added a german squad for interest. Whoever plays graves needs to be able to para down to 20m before opening his chute. and then get into a building. From their he can provide potentially good intel.

 

GPK humvees are the toughest light vehicles for penetrating an AO, but they ony have a 50, If they lead and the landys follow you might be able to penetrate to a defensible position.

 

Remember you can rearm your vehicles by being next to any ammo truck.

 

I recommend that once we have the minimum number to move we should move and the people suffering from glitches and crashes (all of us at one time or another) can para into position.

 

We should practice hot fast inserts by bailing from choppers flying at around 50m on the stock server. We can lead with an apache strafing run followed closely by a uh60, both flying over 250kph, the apache may draw the fire initially, long enough for the jumpers to get on the ground and into cover.

[DaiSan]

I think the whole idea is great but is being based on a faulty model.

 

Domination was never designed to be used for a specific gameplay type but as a battlefield gametype. If we really want to have 'Tactical' CQB nights (which I'm all up for) then we have more than enough talent within SPARTA to build a CQB mission with random towns and AI troop deployment using UPS and building population mods.

 

Trying to get Domination to do this effectively will never work out satisfactorily in my opinion.

[Cent~SPARTA~]

I think the whole idea is great but is being based on a faulty model.

 

Domination was never designed to be used for a specific gameplay type but as a battlefield gametype. If we really want to have 'Tactical' CQB nights (which I'm all up for) then we have more than enough talent within SPARTA to build a CQB mission with random towns and AI troop deployment using UPS and building population mods.

 

Trying to get Domination to do this effectively will never work out satisfactorily in my opinion.

 

I Agree, just with the two quick mis i played this week showed the level of skill within the community to develop our own cqb ops, saddly im not one of em but i still want to help however i can..

[Batwing~SPARTA~]

Great food for your mind here.

 

I do agree with Dai and Durka.

 

I think whoever is able to create missions should create specific missions on the Ghost Recon style for this kind of CQB engagement.

 

I think all depends on the scenario we want to create. Being a CQB , scenario and objectives in a mission are quite different from the simple "Size the City".

We should create a more sensitive objective, choosing from OR multiple Obj as:

 

a - Insert the city and inspect specific building for WMD (weapon Mass Destruction); This involves to get to a specific building and hold it for an amount of time.

 

b - Escort VIP from A to B where on the path has to go through a small village, possibility of ambush. Here a solid convoy should be used. Being able to survive and have VIP alive to point B is the objective. VIP can be played by human with light armor suite and light armament for self defense, however has to be protected from the rest of the team and CANNOT be revived.

 

c - Got an intel about an high sensitive "most wanted" generals meeting ongoing at specific building in town (The Green Zone, if you saw the movie), move in quickly and size the building. Capture or kill targets of importance. I don t know if is possible to capture anyone on this game, but if that is possible it would be great to have 4 charachters dressed DIFFERENT from the others (black suites?) to be used as target of importance, unarmed, while AI has to protect them and we have to capture them possibly alive.

 

Now, these are just basic ideas, but mission and scenarios are endless, i could continue forever. The fact is that all of this has to be structured in a reasonable way.

Does not matter really how many of us are involved on the mission itself ( we are no more than 10 - 15 anyway, when everyone is present), This kind of mission should be created in a "realistic" way.

 

Example:

 

On mission - b, we should choose a quite dense city to pass through, and set as AI a number of "cells" to create ambushes and close range assault to the vehicle. We are not supposed to meet organized militia, neither a strong number of insurgents, so it should not be a battallion in the city waiting to engage 8 or or 10 of us.

This is just an idea, and i would add a max of 2 or 3 deaths available by revive, to make it balanced with the minor number of enemies to face.

I mean, a mission doesn t have to be 1 hour long to be engaging, not all the time at least. We can have a great fun with a fast pace action in 20 minutes and, either we are alive or dead at the end

 

This kind of scenario would force some specific action from our part as:

 

1 - insertion by chopper, very close to target area - sort of SWAT insertion OR large use of Humvees as a convoy

 

2 - limited weapon choice; we are going for a very specific mission, ammobox with tons of waepons make no sense. Mission choose the weapons and soldiers are up to use them. One kind of assault rifle, one kind of MG, grenades, other basic stuff and that s it.

 

3 - AI managing is crucial here if we wanna have fun. I have no idea if this stuff is possible, but

- CAN AI be set to defend a specific small location (a building)?

- CAN AI be set to defend specific charachters?

- CAN AI be set to stealth mode, to hide themself in building with a specific target to engage (specific vehicle on cour convoy or specific charachter) and be ordered to engage only at 100 mtrs ?

 

Honestly, here we are trying to rewrite a different way to use ARMA2 environment.

 

I don t think Arma was supposed to be a Sim for CQB on small areas, but it looks is a very powerful engine, so that would be very nice. But if we cannot bend the engine to our project, the idea to have CQB environment is going to be a failure and then I would stick with the classic Domination, which works well.

Edited July 18, 2010 by Batwing

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

As long as the mission is flexible enough to accomodate 5 to 20 players, is stable enough to play through to the end without crashing, can last up to 4 hours and supports join in progress I am sure it will be fine.

 

kav is working on a CQB mission at this time, but I dont know if it will support all of these features.

 

There is a reason we play domination, it is flexible and is more stable than most missions

 

Until we have one of the "missions" we have tacdom.

[Batwing~SPARTA~]

And I am totally fine with Dom the way Spart plays it. Totally.

 

I think trying to generate one or more solid CQB missions can be a quite large pain in the butt using Arma, I see the problems Lightspeed is having just to try to create a sort of GR mission.

 

I way prefer to have a steady dependable gameplay than trying something exotic crashing and glitching all the time

 

Keep it up Zeno, i know we are in good hands

[Phisher~SPARTA~]

What about using the Zargabad map for the CQB Tacdom? It is definitely large enough, and there are multiple cities, it has about 3.5K by 7K worth of map to play on. No Aircraft except for reinforcements and limited armor. I find the map to be much more pleasing, you can tell the dev's spent a lot more time constructing the neighborhoods, landscape, and terrain.