MP Campaign / In reference to Phisher´s thread " Persistent Game"

[Kavlarakos~SPARTA~]

After reading Phisher´s thread about a persistent game for Arma2 coop, i thought about why not making a complete new MP campaign with an ongoing storyline.

 

Here is the idea:

 

A completely new MP campaign in the domination style which is for example 10 missions big. Each mission will start there where the mission before ended. Each mission will be about 3-4 hours long.

 

I thought for example to start the mission on the carrier, so that the first task would be to establish a new base at the small airfield located in the SW of Chernarus. The objectives could be to take the airstrip and lets say the 3 closest towns. As this mission starts on the carrier it would be logical to have in addition to the ground team also airsupport. Dependent of the direction from which the strike-team approaches the enemy will call reinforcements and also will make a counter-attack to keep it dynamic and realistic.

 

Once the mission is finished the next mission will start, but this time at the captured airstrip and not on the carrier. The objetives for mission 2 could then be for example to seize the next 3 towns. And so on until the whole map is conquered in for instance 10 missions.

 

I think the advantage of this could be to have more dynamic and tactical gameplay because of a hgher detailed mission design. It would be possible to build enemy fortifications, place enemy soldiers into buildings or on top of roofs. It would also be possible to have a big variety of objectives then just only to seize one town after another.

 

 

This is off course a very big project and needs to be done by experienced and motivated people. I would really like to start that project but I need some help for this as i am quite experienced in editing SP missions but never tried to make a MP mission.

 

So if there is somebody interested in this project please contact me.

[MedicSN6]

I have a Campaign in progress in the dialogue and on-paper missions design phase. It is at this phase atm because I am awaiting ACE2 and other mods which the campaign will benefit from. The difference is that it is not Domination or persistent, it is mainly a coop for 1 to 10 players.

[Ebden~SPARTA~]

I have a Campaign in progress in the dialogue and on-paper missions design phase. It is at this phase atm because I am awaiting ACE2 and other mods which the campaign will benefit from. The difference is that it is not Domination or persistent, it is mainly a coop for 1 to 10 players.

 

I know nothing which would help either of you on the technical side, but I'll offer my help nonetheless. (goher for virtual coffee and sweets?)

 

How would you ensure the unique map changes from one coop mission to the next are maintained? In Kav's example, would the players place the field HQ, or would they take a radius and have that count as the claimed HQ? The second leaves it open for Kav to build the HQ as he sees fit. But...this is the consistency part...what about damaged buildings, trees, or terrain? An evolving theatre includes wrecks, craters, and rubble. I hope either of you found a way to bring the unique environmental changes from one mission to the next.

 

Can you salvage anything from the popular 'cipher' or 'behind enemy lines' user missions with pseudo-random enemy placement?

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

Could make a moderated/GM game. You could make a player class (like engineer) that has access to game mechanic triggers to the server. Add a menu to them which would allow access to spawn troops, determine next AO, force counterattacks, etc.

[Ebden~SPARTA~]

Could make a moderated/GM game. You could make a player class (like engineer) that has access to game mechanic triggers to the server. Add a menu to them which would allow access to spawn troops, determine next AO, force counterattacks, etc.

 

That's what the realtime editors are for, right? We haven't considered it on a one-off scenario yet, only as part of a long-term game.

 

So why not? I'd like to try it on one of the new maps, too. It'd give us a chance to explore while listening to the careful story narration of the storyteller, who is also throwing all kinds of hell and death at us.

 

It would work best if a scenario could be playing out in one part of the map while the storyteller was pitching a few things together elsewhere in response to the current mission. Ha, it's sounding more fun as I think about it. Storyteller acts both as intel for players, texting changing objectives while working on the next. It would also mean a switch in immersion, too. No need for pre-defined map markers to describe an objective, the team would have to go by the Storyteller's intel and find their own way (or be provided with occasional friendly support via the storyteller?)

 

How hard would it be to set up the controls for this, or are the programs Real Time Editor or Virtual TrainingSpace3 adequate?

[T_1]

We've used VTS3 for the training that Durka organised, and I've had a play about with it.

 

RTE looks better, tho I haven't used it.

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

I really like this idea and hope it is given some serious attention. Thanks Kav, hopefully we can develop this into something workable. I will help in any way I can.

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

VST3 and RTE need to be hosted from your PC though, not a dedicated server, correct?

[T_1]

VTS3 just runs as a MP Mission, so it can run on a dedi. No idea about RTE tho.

[Kavlarakos~SPARTA~]

I know nothing which would help either of you on the technical side, but I'll offer my help nonetheless. (goher for virtual coffee and sweets?)

 

How would you ensure the unique map changes from one coop mission to the next are maintained? In Kav's example, would the players place the field HQ, or would they take a radius and have that count as the claimed HQ? The second leaves it open for Kav to build the HQ as he sees fit. But...this is the consistency part...what about damaged buildings, trees, or terrain? An evolving theatre includes wrecks, craters, and rubble. I hope either of you found a way to bring the unique environmental changes from one mission to the next.

 

Can you salvage anything from the popular 'cipher' or 'behind enemy lines' user missions with pseudo-random enemy placement?

 

 

This, I fear, is nearly impossible to make it that unique. I meant that the next mission starts at the same point of achieved conditions, of which the finished objectives should take care. But I surly want to add traces of battles like demolished buildings wrecks, dead bodies etc.

 

But I think its not that important that the jeep I left the mission before at a certain spot will be again there exactly in the same spot in the next mission. Also the next mission will start a few hours later as like in reality every mission needs a preparation of at least 1 - 2 hours.

 

To be honest, I don´t really have a mission devoloping for the whole campaign in mind, but at least for the first 3 for example. I also would appreciate any ideas for an ongoing storyline.

 

I definately will start editing the first mission and then I will see where are the problems. And hopefully I will find a solution when encountering any problems.

 

 

 

 

[Kavlarakos~SPARTA~]

I am awaiting ACE2 and other mods which the campaign will benefit from.

 

 

 

Any ideas when Ace2 mod will be released?

[Kavlarakos~SPARTA~]

Could make a moderated/GM game. You could make a player class (like engineer) that has access to game mechanic triggers to the server. Add a menu to them which would allow access to spawn troops, determine next AO, force counterattacks, etc.

 

 

Could be also a nice idea to make individual scenarios. I never used VTS. But I am quite used to the Real Time editor. But RTE has a disadvantage of using a tool called RTE capture which first forms the edited and spawned stuff into a XML file and then into a I think sqm. So in praxis it means that you have to edit, spawn all the stuff, place it where you want, then jump to desktop form it into xml and then sqm, jump again to the game and then it will appear. I just fear that this with all the jumping to desktop and to game will cause some game-crashes.

 

As I saw in the forums the VTS2 tool should work better, but as I said I am not used to it at the moment.

 

Have you used it before and know how it works?

[Ebden~SPARTA~]

Any ideas when Ace2 mod will be released?

 

'When it's done' is the oft-repeated phrase on the BI forums. It sounds like it'll be a couple more months though, from the tone of the thread.

 

While we're waiting:

 

ACE-2 features

[T_1]

Could be also a nice idea to make individual scenarios. I never used VTS. But I am quite used to the Real Time editor. But RTE has a disadvantage of using a tool called RTE capture which first forms the edited and spawned stuff into a XML file and then into a I think sqm. So in praxis it means that you have to edit, spawn all the stuff, place it where you want, then jump to desktop form it into xml and then sqm, jump again to the game and then it will appear. I just fear that this with all the jumping to desktop and to game will cause some game-crashes.

 

As I saw in the forums the VTS2 tool should work better, but as I said I am not used to it at the moment.

 

Have you used it before and know how it works?

 

From what I can see (and having not used RTE) it looks like VTS3 would do what is required, and RTE would not.

 

I've set up a local host before, and spawned a Bluefor and OpFor squads. OpFor were in a small village, central road junction defending. BlueFor approaching to the junction, and a firefight ensued. Small arms, RPG's, GL's nades were all used by both sides. Bear in mind this was an AI v AI contact, but I reckon the OpFpr could give a small to medium real player squad a bit of a headache.

[Kavlarakos~SPARTA~]

From what I can see (and having not used RTE) it looks like VTS3 would do what is required, and RTE would not.

 

I've set up a local host before, and spawned a Bluefor and OpFor squads. OpFor were in a small village, central road junction defending. BlueFor approaching to the junction, and a firefight ensued. Small arms, RPG's, GL's nades were all used by both sides. Bear in mind this was an AI v AI contact, but I reckon the OpFpr could give a small to medium real player squad a bit of a headache.

 

 

Yes I also think that VTS would be the better choice and I will definately get a little bit more used to it just to see of what it is capable of.

 

In generally what I would really appreciate on missions is for example to have several objectives and that one objective is dependent on the success of the first objective.

 

For example: 1st objective could be take out the early radar station and the SAM site around it so that 2nd objective, bring in the troops by choppers and occupy a town, could be achieved. So that a small strike team is on to fulfill objective 1 while a 2nd team with choppers is on station and will take off when 1st objective is done.

 

So the question is: Is VTS capable of making such scenarios?

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

We need to get together on TS to discuss the possibilities, I will grab some people next time I see them on TS together.

[IDAN]

I also know nothing which would help on the technical side.

 

But I can help with ideas for missions.

 

I was thinking about mission that not includes town, like one of the side missions but large scale. Kind of a real military drill.

 

Seizing large open terrain. This terrain will have large hills spread around; the defending a.i will be behind good cover.

 

 

Hill a (lower than b higher than c)

 

 

 

 

 

Hill b

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hill c

 

 

splitting to two fire teams(the movement is from the top) , team a first take hill b which is the highest one and the most important because it provides the best defend cover for hill a and c,after b is taken fire team b will take hill a .

After that it's up for the commander to decide who provides cover for hill c and who's taking it.

There are endless options for this kind of missions; the cover for the assault could artillery heavy 0.5 and snipers.

[IDAN]

I also know nothing which would help on the technical side.

 

But I can help with ideas for missions.

 

I was thinking about mission that not includes town, like one of the side missions but large scale. Kind of a real military drill.

 

Seizing large open terrain. This terrain will have large hills spread around; the defending a.i will be behind good cover.

 

 

Hill a (lower than b higher than c)

 

 

 

 

 

Hill b

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hill c

 

 

splitting to two fire teams(the movement is from the top) , team a first take hill b which is the highest one and the most important because it provides the best defend cover for hill a and c,after b is taken fire team b will take hill a .

After that it's up for the commander to decide who provides cover for hill c and who's taking it.

There are endless options for this kind of missions; the cover for the assault could artillery heavy 0.5 and snipers.

the ilustration is worng hill b should be right of hill a and c

[Kavlarakos~SPARTA~]

I also know nothing which would help on the technical side.

 

But I can help with ideas for missions.

 

I was thinking about mission that not includes town, like one of the side missions but large scale. Kind of a real military drill.

 

Seizing large open terrain. This terrain will have large hills spread around; the defending a.i will be behind good cover.

 

 

Hill a (lower than b higher than c)

 

 

 

 

 

Hill b

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hill c

 

 

splitting to two fire teams(the movement is from the top) , team a first take hill b which is the highest one and the most important because it provides the best defend cover for hill a and c,after b is taken fire team b will take hill a .

After that it's up for the commander to decide who provides cover for hill c and who's taking it.

There are endless options for this kind of missions; the cover for the assault could artillery heavy 0.5 and snipers.

 

 

 

 

I would definately appreciate any help. Either on the technical but also on the creative side.

 

Appearently I started to work something out and I totally agree with you to make a little bit more complcated mission and exciting missions. And as you said the possibilities are endless and the nice thing is that Arma2 with the powerful editor is capable of nearly any scenario thinkable.

 

If you are interested I would like to describe you what I have worked out so far.

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

What you told me earlier is very interesting and I will help to the best of my abilities, can anyone else help as well?

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

Thoughts for the overall campaign

 

As you described it we are a liberation force initially based on a carrier. The first part of the campaign is to attack the radar station on Skalista island from the carrier. This is a logical start.

 

Looking at the map of Chernarus there are

 

2 Airfields (Balota and Krasnostav)

1 Airport (near Vybor)

3 Harbours (Chernagorsk, Elektrozavodsk and Berezino)

 

Lets say that the airport is also a major military base.

 

Lets assume that the country on the northern border is unfriendly and heavily armed and the western border is neutral. The Northern country has subjugated Chernarus and supplies equipment and men, via Grozovy pass to the Main Airport northeast of Vybor

 

Lets say the Capitol is Berezino in the north east.

 

Our Objectives are to:

 

secure the capitol

Secure the 3 Airfields

Secure the 3 Harbours

Render their military ineffective

Limited collateral damage

 

Lets say we are forced to attack quickly and have limited resources.

 

The initial beachhead will be at Kamenka in the southwest and we will push west towards Balota, taking Komarovo on the way. The attack will be with AAV's from the sea to the south.

 

We will establish our initial base at Balota once we have taken it.

 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

From here on we can evolve the story how we want. We know we need to take the more heavily defended northern areas but have to secure the path there. We cannot just blow everything up because this is a friendly country subjugated by its northern neighbour. We cannot attack the northern neighbour for fear of escalating the conflict.

 

I hope this helps build the initial framework for the campaign storyline. If anyone has can flesh it out more please add your comments for discussion

 

Remember the story can involve, major assaults, rescues, sabotage, assinations. The enemy can counter attack in force.

 

more to follow