proposed balance changes

[PANiC]

# Slightly increased the AEK971 recoil.

# Slightly increased the ASVAL recoil.

# Added Extended Mags to the ASVAL.

# Slightly increased the recoil on the M249.

#Reduced the recoil of the SKS rifle.

#Fixed aimed firing max accuracy on the Pecheneg to be consistent with other LMGs.

#Slightly reduced the recoil of the F2000 and restored it to the previous base accuracy.

#Semiautomatic and automatic shotguns firing FRAG rounds now do slightly less splash damage.

#Increased the damage of the G3, M60, and M240 at close range.

#Claymores can now detonate from vehicles and can be used to disable jeeps or kill the passengers in light jeeps. Claymores will not do any damage to heavy vehicles.

#Reduced the spot times on C4 and Claymore projectiles from 30 to 15 sec.

#The Radio Beacon, Mortar, Mav, EOD bot, T-UGS, and SOFLAM should now be much easier to deploy.

#C4 will no longer be detonatable after a player respawns, if the player is revived within 5 seconds he can still detonate his C4.

#The player may now have a maximum number of mines which will persist after the player?s death. Deploying more than the maximum of 6 mines will remove a previous mine from the world.

 

#Claymores now also persist through death, the player can have 2 claymores planted.

#9x39mm rounds no longer benefit from the Sniper headshot bonus.

#Increased the damage of the 9x39mm rounds.

#Fixed the AKS74u damage at max range, it was incorrectly higher than other carbines.

#Increased the damage of the .357 and .44 magnum rounds at max range.

#All semiautomatic and bolt weapons, including all shotgun slugs, now have their maximum damage out to 15m.

#Semiautomatic sniper rifles, Assault Rifles, LMGs, and shotgun slugs now have more consistent damage over long range.

#Tweaked IRNV to be more consistent across all levels.

#Fixed a rendering issue with IRNV view when taking damage.

#Tweaked the IRNV zoom times and scope visible areas to be the same across all weapons (some were faster than others).

#Fixed the QBU-88 sniper and the L96 IRNV scopes to use the proper aiming reticule.

#The spread for Flechette rounds has been reduced slightly on all shotguns.

#The spread for buckshot has been reduced on the M1014, DAO-12, and S12k. These weapons have an accuracy advantage over the USAS12 but are not as accurate as the 870.

#Semiautomatic weapons will no longer ?jam? if the player presses fire faster than the weapon is capable of shooting. Some semi automatic weapons have had their rates of fire adjusted to fit this change.

 

#Slightly reduced the effective blast radius of the RPG, SMAW, and 40mm grenade projectiles against infantry.

#Reduced the total number of RPG and SMAW missiles carried from 5 to 4.

#Tank rounds will now instantly destroy Jets, Attack Helicopters, and Scout Helicopters.

#Fixed a problem when locking on to two nearby targets, the locking should no longer jump rapidly between multiple targets.

#Significantly increased the damage of the Javelin and Air to Ground missiles against laser designated targets.

#Javelin missiles fired without laser targeting now do more damage to the side and rear of MBTs.

#Slightly reduced the locking time of all weapons vs Laser Designated targets.

#Increased the locking distance for Jets when locking on laser designated targets.

#Slightly reduced the repair speed of the repair tool.

#Increased the damage the MBT?s primary weapon does to other main battle tanks.

#AA Missiles should no longer kill the pilot instead of the vehicle.

#Reduced the damage AA missiles do to jets.

#Stinger and IGLA missiles now do 50% damage to Jets, Attack Helicopters, and Scout Helicopters.

#Slightly reduced the damage of Jet cannons.

#Increased RPG and SMAW damage against aircraft.

#Guided Rockets will now only track ground targets, as originally intended.

#Reduced the direct damage done by helicopter gunners vs armor.

#Helicopter guns should now suppress correctly.

#Improved the accuracy of the Mi28 gun to match the AH1 gun.

#Increased the direct hit damage of the APFSDS rounds for the IFVs.

#Miniguns and Helicopter Gunners now more quickly destroy parked cars.

#Increased the power of explosions from cars and other explosive static objects.

#Dying from the explosion of a car or other explosive static object should now correctly credit the player who caused the explosion.

#Adjusted the F35′s Center of Mass and Lift Engine for more stable, level flight.

#Updated the F35 weapon systems to be consistent with the other air craft.

#Changed the Kornets to TOW launchers on Wake Island and moved the spawn position of the AAV to a more level position.

#Fixed several bugs with air vehicles colliding with objects at high speeds and taking no damage.

#Players will no longer receive suicides or team kills if they crash their vehicle (dying is punishment enough).

#You can now spot with the EODbot.

#Increased the spawn protection time from 1sec to 2sec. The protection will still be immediately canceled as soon as the player moves or shoots.

#Spawn protection will no longer be canceled by the player looking around.

#Slightly increased the speed at which a player can shoot again after sprinting.

#Fixed some situations that would unintentionally make a player unrevivable.

#Reduced the black screen fade in time on spawn.

[PANiC]

missed this bit:

 

 

 

This list includes some direct responses to that feedback, as well as a very important issue close to several player's hearts: Aggressive Recon.

 

Bolt action sniper rounds now have a chance to kill at close range if the player is hit in the upper chest.

 

Why are we making this change?

-Aggressive Recon was a popular (and controversial) play style in BFBC2, the fact that the playstyle is essentially not present in BF3 has been a disappointment to many players.

-The balance issues of BC2 (Magnum ammo increasing the 1 hit kill range) is not present in BF3, the range is set and cannot be improved by players. Additionally the 1 hit kill is not guaranteed in BF3, the target is small and can be blocked by the player's arms.

-Additionally, all kits have access to the Slug shotguns, the 870 pump with slugs is still far superior to a bolt action rifle at close range. It is faster, and it can hit anywhere in the torso to 1 hit kill, though it lacks the accuracy of the snipers at range.

-Finally, Recon is under represented in the game, especially in CQB game modes, giving the Recon player a place in CQB is important to us as developers.

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

There's no point to a sniper in CQB, that's why they're called snipers.

 

If it's a class of Recon, though, which is to scout areas, maybe there's a point. I use it mainly to set up spawn beacons for my teammates, that's about it.

[Cylawyer~SPARTA~]

hmmmmm

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

-Finally, Recon is under represented in the game, especially in CQB game modes, giving the Recon player a place in CQB is important to us as developers.

 

Are they on crack? There are more snipers in typical games than you can shake a stick at.

[AlarmedBread]

I only use recon as a CQB class, 2 shot kills with M39 iron sights or acog? Yes please!

 

The future for us tank lovers is not looking great. It's already so easy to take down tanks why make everything damage them more? I guess the balance is for normal mode, but on hardcore 2-3 shots and the tank is out, usually that is instant since everyone is playing engineer. What I'd really like is some more APC action on all the maps.

[Ebden~SPARTA~]

The future for us tank lovers is not looking great. It's already so easy to take down tanks why make everything damage them more? I guess the balance is for normal mode, but on hardcore 2-3 shots and the tank is out, usually that is instant since everyone is playing engineer. What I'd really like is some more APC action on all the maps.

 

I don't think tanks are that far off the mark, but from the beginning I've been dissapointed for the lack of a commander (player coordination) role. I mean really, would any commanding officer send a tank into tight urban terrain without close infantry support?

 

I'm guilty as the rest of us for taking the Rambo mentality to a tank and charging right through battle areas, or making all kinds of noise on a close flank ....

"Brwawwwwww...!"

Support:Hey did you hear that?

Sparky:Yeah I think it's an M1 coming down by Office

Support:Do you have your RPG?

Sparky:Yup, and their infantry is still at spawn.

Support:Cool-I'll go C4 'im. You watch my back....

 

For tanks, if they wanted to encourage more role appropriate play, then they might need to work with the radius-based defence point system. Bonus for infantry support near tanks. And also a tank bonus for working close to infantry as armor support. What could that be, something like saviour points?

 

As for Recon, they have handy access to enough CQB weapons that I've found myself spawning as one for the same intention as Durka, but carrying on suitably with whatever buzzbox gun I chose at spawn. I'd like to see more role-appropriate play which would have to be forced by a different weapon selection for Recon. Leave the Recon primary weapons as long guns, no MP7, 45, shotguns, whatever else, and give them a couple more G18-type options for secondary weapons, automatic/bullpup and short-range effective only.

 

That gets toward the Project Reality method for gameplay from BF2/ARMA2, by limiting play styles in game, but the commander function would really help for the bulk of play that can't be scripted in code. Someone goes lone wolf and doesn't support what the commander wants? No ammo drop. Players stick with that armor toward the objective, then their arty calls get answered.

 

 

I just reread this last line:

"giving the Recon player a place in CQB is important to us as developers."

 

As developers? Don't they mean as marketers? I don't hold it against them; I play knowing that I'm outside the bullseye of their target audience (gameplay development target) but well withing the marketing target. I bought it, didn't I?

[MH6~SPARTA~]

#AA Missiles should no longer kill the pilot instead of the vehicle.

#Reduced the damage AA missiles do to jets.

#Stinger and IGLA missiles now do 50% damage to Jets, Attack Helicopters, and Scout Helicopters.

#Guided Rockets will now only track ground targets, as originally intended.

 

Thank god! Now they need to make fucking Javelins a ground-only weapon as well, or at least remove their ability to track jets. That shit is dumb.

 

Since the last patch I've pretty much just stayed out of the air due to the extreme amount of lasing going on (which completely negates IR flares). So now you get hit by both lased and IR missiles constantly, but Dice only allows you have countermeasures for one of them at a time. Great work. Armor truly is the new king of Battlefield, aircraft are now middle-tier.

 

/rant over

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

Are they on crack? There are more snipers in typical games than you can shake a stick at.

 

 

Short answer: Yes

 

Nothing makes me happier than getting shot from 100m by a sniper standing up and moving side to side while drawing down on me in with a 12x scope that probably only shows my nose hairs.

[PANiC]

seems like he recon class has been branded the underpowered class from day one (crappy perks), i think this might be ea's way of trying to get recon on the map as such? personally i think they should give 'em wookie suits and take off the scope reflection and let them go for the hills, but i suspect you would get a wookie fest like in BC2 :/

 

i dont think the tweaks work equally well in softcore vs hardcore., some of the tweaks make a big deal in s/c. meh i'll never understand the point in s/c except in meatgrinder servers which are in a world of their own anyway.

 

 

does anyone know if the fire mode selector (and lesser extent the ammo counter) display is only available in softcore? i struggle with the fire mode sometimes because there is no visual indicator and i dont always want to pull the trigger to find out the mode. bugs me that you can have a minimap that shows enemy locations in h/c but you are not allowed to see if your gun is semi, burst or auto

[AlarmedBread]

Yes in normal mode you see ammo and fire mode.

 

I find it depends on teamwork with vehicles. I have been with two other tanks on comms and dominated the battlefield destroying every enemy vehicle easily, but also been raped by jets and helos all round long. If jets are used properly with a SOFLAM or CITV and do high speed passes they are nearly impossible to shoot down from the ground due to the short range of guided weapons. In hardcore one guided missile from a jet is a critical hit anywhere on the tank. Air is still superior because they always engage on their own terms. It all depends on which team is using the guided weapons and supporting their vehicles better, but it's mostly pointless because if the tanks are dumb enough to go cap a flag they are dead.

[Rooster90]

In normal play maybe the Recon is overplayed. But in the competitive scene Recons are very rare. They're only used for the TUGS/MAV bug. (MAV bug = land a Mav anywhere and it acts like a TUGS, revealing players within a wide radius). I think that's what a few of those balance changes are meant for (competition). DICE are slowly realizing that if they don't cater to the competitive/pro teams the game will quickly lose interest and will be dropped in favor of another more comp-friendly game. I know it's quickly losing my interest without important features like Battlerecorder or any sort of Spectate mode. It'll still be a fun game to play, but when the competitive scene dies, the game dies.