Opfor BigDom Ver N

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

Working on Verion N.1 to make some minor balancing/fixes. However, I wanted to also share that I have a bit of new content as well: When AO is spawned, roads leading into the AO could now have blockades.

 

Ok, version N.1 is up on FTP for Zeno. Changes:

 

Features Added

• Added dispersion addon code directly into map- this will change the behaviour of the AI to be a bit more realistic with less 9mm sniping by AI at 1000m.
• Added roadblocks to random entry roads into an AO. This adds markers for OPFOR to know where they are, an actual roadblock and a small bunker spawned along with an AT team in defend mode.

 

Bug Fixes

• Disabled the Ambient module for now until bug resolved that may be contributing to the AO not being drawn correctly.
• Fixed bug within the OPFOR artillery that could disable it from working correctly.

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

Hey Kal, I got a chance to play one of the all-infantry towns yesterday and had a blast. Taking enemy vehicles away really changes the dynamic of the game for the better, as it seems to get the guys (most) to stick closer together. Not to mention the sheer ammount of gunfire going off, it was sooo much better.

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

Cool. Next version I may shift some of the forest heavy towns into troop only situations, such as Nadezhdeno.

[peter~SPARTA~]

Kal,

Last version had some respowning issues for opfor commander.

When i get killed just before taking AO over i respown not in new AO but back in old one. I had to die one more time to spown in new AO. That's give almost 10 min penalty to opfor commander.

Also Blue force was able to kill me again when i was dead, witch double penalty time.

 

All that let Blue force to be in new AO before i was there. Can we delay showing up of next AO till all 3 opfor soldiers be there and amno box is placed?

Also i notice you change AA units to be independent from opfor commander, i was not able to reposition shilka or order igla pod to shoot down aircraft's flying overhead.

Im really concern about enemy icons not showing up. I had several situations when blue troops was just meters from opfor, and there was no icons of enemy in AO. More , i was looking at enemy but there was no red dots on the map as well.

AI did not react even when they have guy standing in a front of them 20m for several seconds, no icon on the map, no fire was open. Also , red dots of killed guys show up for like 2 minutes after we killed them.

 

I would reconsider having small AO's at all, there is no safe place to respown. I was trow twice yesterday no farther then 100 m from place i died, it end up for me being dead before i was even able to look at map to chk where i am.

Edited February 3, 2010 by peter~SPARTA~

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

Kal,

1) Last version had some respowning issues for opfor commander.

When i get killed just before taking AO over i respown not in new AO but back in old one. I had to die one more time to spown in new AO. That's give almost 10 min penalty to opfor commander.

Also Blue force was able to kill me again when i was dead, witch double penalty time.

 

All that let Blue force to be in new AO before i was there. Can we delay showing up of next AO till all 3 opfor soldiers be there and amno box is placed?

2) Also i notice you change AA units to be independent from opfor commander, i was not able to reposition shilka or order igla pod to shoot down aircraft's flying overhead.

 

3) Im really concern about enemy icons not showing up. I had several situations when blue troops was just meters from opfor, and there was no icons of enemy in AO. More , i was looking at enemy but there was no red dots on the map as well.

AI did not react even when they have guy standing in a front of them 20m for several seconds, no icon on the map, no fire was open. Also , red dots of killed guys show up for like 2 minutes after we killed them.

 

4) I would reconsider having small AO's at all, there is no safe place to respown. I was trow twice yesterday no farther then 100 m from place i died, it end up for me being dead before i was even able to look at map to chk where i am.

 

You are covering a bunch of stuff so let me try to seperate it into your logical points:

 

1) This is a painful error and I think due to the joys of UDP network traffic and the Arma client itself. The code will push the opfor into the AO before anyone else knows about it. BUT, the fact that you said that BlueFOR was able to kill you when you were already dead, tells me that your PC was bugged. I have seen this happen when you become the "Error: No Unit" guy and the map doesn't know who you are or what side you are on and then it loses track of teleporting you, reviving you correctly and throwing you on the top right corner of map, or leaves you at your sme spot standing up for no reason at all.

 

2) AA units are independant along with all statics, this was changed with version N so that the AO worked much better. This is because once the high command goes into gear, they become super dumb and wouldn't shoot things down unless you literally landed on top of them. When HC was in action, you really couldn't dependable force the Igla/Shilka's to engage anyway.

 

3) Very little I can do about this entire #3. The blue icons in HC are based on group leaders only. If individual units are running around, you won't see them. The red icons are based on what you and your group can visibly see - that is, you and the other two human opfor players. This is why when BLUFor all gets in the same team, they can share information about things all over the map. All of the EAST units are in their own groups and only share information local to each other. All "red dots" have a 2 minute decay based on a variable called "knowsabout". Also, when revive is in play, when you kill someone, they don't respawn immediately so it appears they are still there.. because they are, just unconscious.

 

4) The smallest AO is 400m radius, that's 800m across. Its the smallest I plan to do. If West is all over the AO, there is no safe place to spawn and it will default to the center of town.

[MedicSN6]

I loved that post. A huge post of "here's what you don't understand and this is what I'm not going to do about it."

 

I love it. Very informative though.

 

Really?

[Ebden~SPARTA~]

I loved that post. A huge post of "here's what you don't understand and this is what I'm not going to do about it."

 

I love it. Very informative though.

 

Really?

 

Ouch. Is this an exciting flame war about to begin? I love 'em, I just don't participate in 'em (except for this perfunctory post).

[MedicSN6]

Ouch. Is this an exciting flame war about to begin? I love 'em, I just don't participate in 'em (except for this perfunctory post).

 

NO! Not a flame at all. Just a funny observation. Made me laugh.

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

Ouch. Is this an exciting flame war about to begin? I love 'em, I just don't participate in 'em (except for this perfunctory post).

 

I think Medic must have had his cheerios pissed in today and wants to take it out on all of us And besides, flame wars don't happen often here, and on the odd occasion they do, they're snuffed out pretty quick.

[MedicSN6]

I think Medic must have had his cheerios pissed in today and wants to take it out on all of us And besides, flame wars don't happen often here, and on the odd occasion they do, they're snuffed out pretty quick.

 

What Durka failed to relay is that I am the one who starts most of them. Then Halli or Zeno needs to pull me aside and remind me that this isn't a group of two-year-olds etc. etc. and I hang my head and say "I'm sorry guys," and then go sit in the corner and cry and wet myself because I don't want Halli to beat me with the ball bat anymore.

 

[peter~SPARTA~]

Kal,

I feel like AI is a lot dumber then couple week's ago.

Last week Blue was able to drive in to AO in a tank, i had several AT squads around them and they did not engage, to the point where i saw AT soldier being run over by tank. He did not even bother to deploy rpg.

In other occasion i had Tusk inside town and my T72 10m away behind the corner of brick fence. My t72 did not react to danger even if i was trying to move him. Tusk show as red vech icon, but i was not able to to send any troops to destroy him. He was basically picking up all my troops without being punished.

 

 

I was assuming all opfor units report to HQ and this way all opfor live players can see enemy. I had Scorpion reporting enemy foot soldiers but neither he or I was able to see them on the map.

Somehow it change when squad commander become one of snipers after dead of commander. We all go blind.

 

There was one more thing i like to ask. I capture avenger yesterday, after i board it my own troops killed me, it was strange.

As for size of AO, there is only problem when phosphorus rounds are deployed by blue's, there is basically no place to run from this toxic gas. Can we have NBC suits pls? ;-)

 

As for small improvement, could you change default weapon for opfor commander to scoped AK47 or SVD? Spowning with baby gun in the middle of battle is very challenging. When there is no way to get in tho the box after log in.

 

KalXen, don't get me wrong pls. Im not complaining , just reporting.

I really appreciate your dedication and hard work to improve gameplay.

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

Commanders aren't snipers.

[peter~SPARTA~]

I loved that post. A huge post of "here's what you don't understand and this is what I'm not going to do about it."

 

I love it. Very informative though.

 

Really?

 

Its not like i don't understand Kal's limitation in programing .

I just like to point things that are problem for me as opfor commander. If he is able to do something about that that's great. If not, that's ok as well. Opfor is there not to win, but to make you life's more miserable.

My intention is just to make AI more human like reaction.

 

Durka , i know

But i feel naked with this AKM in hand

Edited February 3, 2010 by peter~SPARTA~

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

I loved that post. A huge post of "here's what you don't understand and this is what I'm not going to do about it."

 

I love it. Very informative though.

 

Really?

 

Too funny. Well, I could of ignored the post if you'd rather - but my version of "Sparta Customer Support" would rather explain what I understand about a bug, and if I can fix it I will/have. I think I have killed hundreds of bugs in this map, and the big ones left are the untouchables.. and Peter kinda hit em. If you read a negative tone from my post, you read it wrong.

 

#1 I have spent dozens of hours trying to fix and it keeps coming back. This bug sucks and makes me feel I spend more time coding than playing. I'll keep plugging away cuz its a bad itch.

 

#2 is a balancing tweak, original change was made because someone complained that the AA units were not doing anything. I don't mind throwing in some units you can control, no biggie. I don't care about reverting either. The beat goes on.

 

#3 is a game mechanic I can't fix unless we add 10-15 more human players on OPFOR and they have eyeballs everywhere. OR, I increase the reveal/knowsabout logic of all the EAST AI, and they will know you are coming before you are within 300m of the AO, OR I create some kind of UAV that OPFOR can use to scan the area and learn.

 

#4 I could fix by just not allowing opfor to spawn in the AO if BlueFor has it over-run.. but I don't think those guys would enjoy being spawned at a campsite on top of a mountain with a pack of playing cards for 10-15 minutes.

[MedicSN6]

Its not like i don't understand Kal's limitation in programing .

I just like to point things that are problem for me as opfor commander. If is able to do something about that that's great. If not, that's ok as well. Opfor is there not to win, but to make you life's more miserable.

My intention is just to make AI more human like reaction.

 

Yeah man no problem. You made very good points. Thanks for bringing them to the table. I was just marveling at Kal's post that's all. Glad to have you here.

[peter~SPARTA~]

#2 is a balancing tweak, original change was made because someone complained that the AA units were not doing anything. I don't mind throwing in some units you can control, no biggie. I don't care about reverting either. The beat goes on.

I believe it was me

It would be nice too add 2-3 more Igla pods, manned or not around AO

 

#3 is a game mechanic I can't fix unless we add 10-15 more human players on OPFOR and they have eyeballs everywhere. OR, I increase the reveal/knowsabout logic of all the EAST AI, and they will know you are coming before you are within 300m of the AO, OR I create some kind of UAV that OPFOR can use to scan the area and learn.

Mby is there way to attach all units to same group? Somehow it was working much better couple weeks ago. Dunno is you change anything what may hit that properties.

 

#4 I could fix by just not allowing opfor to spawn in the AO if BlueFor has it over-run.. but I don't think those guys would enjoy being spawned at a campsite on top of a mountain with a pack of playing cards for 10-15 minutes.

 

I think changing spown point form middle to edge of AO could improve that.

Like spown center of AO+ size of AO -50 m

 

 

Somehow did not touch most important issue cuz i kind of just to it.

Its server stability. We had several crashes after 1-2 AO's finished. After each crash i have t bother you guys about restarting server manually.

Is there anything that can be done about that?

Edited February 3, 2010 by peter~SPARTA~

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

Kal,

I feel like AI is a lot dumber then couple week's ago.

Last week Blue was able to drive in to AO in a tank, i had several AT squads around them and they did not engage, to the point where i saw AT soldier being run over by tank. He did not even bother to deploy rpg.

In other occasion i had Tusk inside town and my T72 10m away behind the corner of brick fence. My t72 did not react to danger even if i was trying to move him. Tusk show as red vech icon, but i was not able to to send any troops to destroy him. He was basically picking up all my troops without being punished.

 

 

I was assuming all opfor units report to HQ and this way all opfor live players can see enemy. I had Scorpion reporting enemy foot soldiers but neither he or I was able to see them on the map.

Somehow it change when squad commander become one of snipers after dead of commander. We all go blind.

 

There was one more thing i like to ask. I capture avenger yesterday, after i board it my own troops killed me, it was strange.

As for size of AO, there is only problem when phosphorus rounds are deployed by blue's, there is basically no place to run from this toxic gas. Can we have NBC suits pls? ;-)

 

As for small improvement, could you change default weapon for opfor commander to scoped AK47 or SVD? Spowning with baby gun in the middle of battle is very challenging. When there is no way to get in tho the box after log in.

 

KalXen, don't get me wrong pls. Im not complaining , just reporting.

I really appreciate your dedication and hard work to improve gameplay.

 

No worries, keep it coming.

 

Stupid AI: When you are marking waypoints for the AI as OPFOR commander, are you editing the waypoint to change their tactic to "Search and Destroy", or are you just giving them default "Move" orders? Because if you give them a waypoint, and just tell them to move from A-B, they are dumb and will walk into fire to some degree. In version N of the map, I set the default mode of the AI to be in combat awareness. So the AI should be by default much more active. However, this may reset if you do just default move orders.

 

Icons: BTW, if the map is in veteran mode now, there will be NO blue markers on the map. So we need to be consistent on what we want the HC to be able to see. Keep in mind, if you want to play the OPFOR commander, log into the game cleanly and join as the Officer. Don't just swap from bufor to opfor while game in progress.

 

Avenger: If the AI had engaged someone in a vehicle, and the player was killed, they may still have angst against the Avnger ntil it is detroyed. We have seen this sometimes when someone brings a captured EAST armor back to the WEST base.. the AI on base will attack it, even if driven by WEST.

 

Default Weapon: Its kit based on what kind of unit you spawn as. Thats what an officer gets by default. Instead of messing with each person's choice, just stick to the ammo box. It makes the ammobox a valuable asset to defend.

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

I think changing spown point form middle to edge of AO could improve that.

Like spown center of AO+ size of AO -50 m

 

Somehow did not touch most important issue cuz i kind of just to it.

Its server stability. We had several crashes after 1-2 AO's finished. After each crash i have t bother you guys about restarting server manually.

Is there anything that can be done about that?

 

 

Spawn: The code actually randomly picks 50 locations within the AO and tests to see if they are good spawn locations for 1) size of your body, 2) not water, and 3) WEST isn't within 150 m. This is up to 95% of the AO edge. I'll see what we can do to change this around to a safer spot.

 

Stability: Typically after I hear that we have a server crash I ask Zeno to send me the RPT file from the server. This last time, I can't find any errors. The only thing I can see is that the server is trying to keep track of a bunch of ghost objects that don't exist anymore, typically dead EAST units. As a precaution based on the last crash feedback and AO's not spawning properly, I removed my ambient module in N.1 in hopes of seeing if it was the cuplrit.

 

Edit: One more note on stability - High Command module is a memory hog. We never saw these "out of memory" issues until we started to do Opfor commander. We might just be pushing the total # of AI units for opfor too high, or the map isn't cleaning up well.

[peter~SPARTA~]

No worries, keep it coming.

 

Stupid AI: When you are marking waypoints for the AI as OPFOR commander, are you editing the waypoint to change their tactic to "Search and Destroy", or are you just giving them default "Move" orders? Because if you give them a waypoint, and just tell them to move from A-B, they are dumb and will walk into fire to some degree. In version N of the map, I set the default mode of the AI to be in combat awareness. So the AI should be by default much more active. However, this may reset if you do just default move orders.

 

After AO start i try to move tanks and apc's from open also moving troops away from places where is crowded so enemy mortar cannot take them easy. Those units usually behave correct and spot enemy and fight them , even later when they destroy somone and wait for another to come. Those not touched by me remain dumb and blind. (special Kord emplacements.)

When/if there is enemy icon i order them to attack (red circle)

 

Icons: BTW, if the map is in veteran mode now, there will be NO blue markers on the map. So we need to be consistent on what we want the HC to be able to see. Keep in mind, if you want to play the OPFOR commander, log into the game cleanly and join as the Officer. Don't just swap from bufor to opfor while game in progress.

I believe we play mostly/only in regular mode. The best would be every enemy trooper to show as blue icon, this way i can send my troops to fight them. When they appear as red dots im not able to deal with them. So arty operators and squad leaders are only in danger. Other low ranked slots remain undetectable and if spotted, AI dont bother them at all unless they fire on them . Then its kind of too late.

 

Avenger: If the AI had engaged someone in a vehicle, and the player was killed, they may still have angst against the Avnger ntil it is detroyed. We have seen this sometimes when someone brings a captured EAST armor back to the WEST base.. the AI on base will attack it, even if driven by WEST.

 

We had several incidents with shoot down enemy helis/planes and shilka's, they keep firing at destroyed blue choppers and wipe out friendlie's squads who where in their line of fire.

Bad thing is, vehicle like LAV, tank, humvee is able to drive fast in to AO and be not shoot by AI, after i kill crew and board enemy vech , AI kill me within 5 sec. They shoot at me, not at enemy when they suppose to .

So, im not able to capture vehicycle but ble is able to do it with my UAZ and ZU23 due to lack of blue AI.

 

Default Weapon: Its kit based on what kind of unit you spawn as. Thats what an officer gets by default. Instead of messing with each person's choice, just stick to the ammo box. It makes the ammobox a valuable asset to defend.

 

Yes and no, it is valuable asset till i not get there and arm myself, after that i dont need it.(mostly). Also it not possible to defend it when enemy mortars can kill every live personnel with couple of rounds with phosphorus. We cannot stick to this area and defend it.

There is also one thing we cannot deal with , with multiple directions to defend, its really hard to stick to one area to defend it cuz someone can parachute from different angle and take us out, knowing where we are. AO have 360 degree front line and whatever we do we fight always surrounded and shoots come from all directions.

[peter~SPARTA~]

Stability: Typically after I hear that we have a server crash I ask Zeno to send me the RPT file from the server. This last time, I can't find any errors. The only thing I can see is that the server is trying to keep track of a bunch of ghost objects that don't exist anymore, typically dead EAST units. As a precaution based on the last crash feedback and AO's not spawning properly, I removed my ambient module in N.1 in hopes of seeing if it was the cuplrit.

 

Edit: One more note on stability - High Command module is a memory hog. We never saw these "out of memory" issues until we started to do Opfor commander. We might just be pushing the total # of AI units for opfor too high, or the map isn't cleaning up well.

 

Mby its not enough to find out pattern, but last 3 crashes happen 1 min after opfor commander (me) was killed.

Once it happen in first AO after mission restart, 2-3 times in second AO

 

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

Mby its not enough to find out pattern, but last 3 crashes happen 1 min after opfor commander (me) was killed.

Once it happen in first AO after mission restart, 2-3 times in second AO

 

 

Root cause analysis is starting to point to you as the cause of our server crashes. I suggest you don't play anymore.

 

kiddin..

[peter~SPARTA~]

lol, i told them yesterday to not shoot at me cuz if i day server die

 

Anyway, im still wondering what kind of beacon DeltaSierra placed in my ass, so he can find me so easy

 

[KalXen~SPARTA~]

Yes and no, it is valuable asset till i not get there and arm myself, after that i dont need it.(mostly). Also it not possible to defend it when enemy mortars can kill every live personnel with couple of rounds with phosphorus. We cannot stick to this area and defend it.

There is also one thing we cannot deal with , with multiple directions to defend, its really hard to stick to one area to defend it cuz someone can parachute from different angle and take us out, knowing where we are. AO have 360 degree front line and whatever we do we fight always surrounded and shoots come from all directions.

 

The WP mortar stuff is kinda cheesy. Mortar gets 8 shots of it and can bascially take out an entire town alone in @ 15 minutes.

 

As for the balance issues for OPFOR defense, etc - Domination is made for Opfor to lose. Otherwise I would remove the teleporting code to keep you from the AO, increase the total # of opfor players, and change the map type to TvT - thus allowing opfor to leave the AO and flank, etc. But thats a different map that I'm developing altogether.

[peter~SPARTA~]

The WP mortar stuff is kinda cheesy. Mortar gets 8 shots of it and can bascially take out an entire town alone in @ 15 minutes.

 

Yes, thats why im against small AO's

 

As for the balance issues for OPFOR defense, etc - Domination is made for Opfor to lose. Otherwise I would remove the teleporting code to keep you from the AO, increase the total # of opfor players, and change the map type to TvT - thus allowing opfor to leave the AO and flank, etc. But thats a different map that I'm developing altogether.

 

But before we loos, its nice to have right tools to make attackers life misserable. IIRC that was whole point of adding opfor commander to Dom.

 

Really what i wont is just unlimited amno to smaws, iglas and javelins/metis. So i can be like Rambo

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

The idea was to have the ai controlled by a human. I would like to see it go back to that, with no snipers. Then have a seperate TvT map.