Arma Match 10 Aug 2008 - SERVER 2 (SUNDAY)

[NoScream~SPARTA~]

12 MAX

 

THE MAP is COOP (12 MAN MAX) OPERATION PENETRATION

 

Mission is top secret, plenty of weapons & resupplies, AA elimination/ BMP & infantry

Land movement, enemy vehicles only.

 

 

 

 

 

We are playing BLUE ( US Weapons)

 

 

THE RULES

 

START TIME (DUST OFF) is 1800 BST 1300 EST

SERVER 2

 

MISSION is DAY / CLEAR - OVERCAST/ RAIN

 

50 Seconds RESPAWN, SERVER JIP OFF

Friendly AI OFF - HEALING is OFF FIRST AID is ON

 

 

All targets are hostile

 

If a new player joins we will allow them in if = the mission is less than 5 mins in

or all members are dead & we start again.

 

 

2 hour limit ? any questions ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

GET THIS MOD - OPTIONAL but it gives TRACERS & ALOT of nice touches.

 

Get this mod it's CLIENT SIDE, self installing

 

 

 

Add this to the properties

-mod=6thSenseMisc;@6thSenseMod;@6thSenseQG

 

 

Adds plenty of enhancements inc TRACERS

 

 

 

DOWNLOAD from HERE

http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=468

 

1Gb mod

6th Sense ArmA Mod

 

Description:

This Modification is created for usage on 6thSense.eu servers. (And as such Made for MP)

But it may and can be used by other communities or individuals.

The package has been made with many different considerations, some realism, some gameplay, some for fun.

The main idea of the Mod, is to have a uniformal classes system with many many different units, vehicles

scripts, further enhancements, all made compatible with eachother inside 1 mod.

Newer Modules will become available in the future, examples could be WW2, Vietnam etc. etc.

Original Units, Vehicles, Weapons etc. are unaffacted. This mod needs updated Missions.

(Auto-replace templates for PowerGREP are included in the @6thSenseMod\Tools folder)

[kiltor2]

Are you all using this mod on your servers? what other mods do you use? I have been playing on the evo server and I am willing to go tactical when you guys want to if I am on. When do you all do your training missions and such?

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

Hi Buddy you do not need any mods to join the server and you will be more than welcome.

 

 

[kiltor2]

Thanks Zeno I appreciate it!!

[NoScream~SPARTA~]

Exactly as Zeno said, at the moment you don't need any mods.

[DaiSan]

Can we have some debriefs from people?

 

Personally I think we desperately need some SOP's (Standard Operating Procedures) laid down for basic manoeuvres and engagements.

 

These should include:

 

Formations and movement - (We need to make sure we keep an adequate distance between each other otherwise Grenades or suppressing fire means we take multiple casualties and we need to move in sequence. Personally I prefer bounding as this means the person in front can keep checking flanks etc while the person behind moves forward until he finds good cover and then he can cover the next person.)

 

Rules of Engagement - (No one should engage an enemy unless he or his squad mates are directly threatened or taking fire. All engagements should be planned and executes so as to minimise casualties. This SOP should also include weapon status and this should be strictly adhered to, if weapon status is RED then even if you take fire you do NOT shoot back).

 

Command structure - (It should be clear to everyone on insert WHO and WHAT the command structure is. This should be agreed upon before the mission is started).

 

These are the most BASIC SOP's, there are numerous others and I'm not saying the ones I have stated above are right, other people may have better ideas for ArmA.

 

Obviously those I have stated are VERY brief descriptions just to give a general idea that can be debated here.

 

Last nights game was generally good and apart from a few errors from all of us it went as well as can be expected at this early stage.

Edited August 11, 2008 by Dai-San~SPARTA~

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

Here's some quick observations I gotta say about last night's game, before my comp froze up on me and I had to leave:

 

1. Command Structure: One guy has to be in charge, and one guy only. It doesn't matter who he is, but he's gotta be clear and consise and have a strategy for taking a farmhouse or outpost. Everyone should listen to him and only him, no questions or no comments. If the plan fails, then that's just fine, try doing better when you're the leader.

 

2. Bounding: The most effictive way is to move up in short bursts. One or two soldiers move foward while the rest provide cover. When the foward soldier(s) are set up in a good position, they in turn cover while the back element moves to their position. Then the soldiers move again once cover has been provided. There are a couple reasons this option is better than the "leapfrog" or the back element not stopping at the foward and advancing much further:

a: Soldiers get tired when running and too much will throw aim off significantly.

b: Guns are constantly in a good covering position when done the right way. If a soldier runs far past his cover, he is just running without cover. This will not work on a hill or in wooded areas. It might work in wide open, flat areas.

 

3. When moving from a longer conflict, to the farm house, nobody knew exactly if weapons were free. The leader needed to let us know or we're all dead. Something like "Weapons free on the farm complex, somebody recon the outer perimeter but hold fire" will work.

 

4. When we set up to take the bridge, we had a great position. We were all in a line along a rise in the terrain, hidden. We had accurate intel that there was armor on our right, yet our AT soldier was in the middle or the left. The attack went great, but the enemy flanked left on foot and destroyed those guys (me). When a plan is made, one has to look 2 steps ahead. Putting the AT soldiers on the right flank to take care of the armor just in case would have been a sound judgement, yet also flanking left with the enemy would have also worked. Nobody moved really once fire broke out, when it should've worked like a swinging door, with the commander in the middle or middle-right being the hinge. I'm not sure exactly what happened afterwards as my comp freezed up at this point, but I see you got through the mission.

 

5. Terrain makes a huge difference when ambushing a patrol. I'll make some graphics up later when I get time

 

Hope this helps

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

A few thoughts,

 

1. Despite comments to the contrary, playing together as a team will, overtime, result in improved play. Simply because the cause of failure will slowly be reduced or eliminated. The first mission I participated in went really well and represented a huge step forward for us. Obviously subsequent improvements will get progressively smaller.

 

2. There were only two loose shots yesterday, I was responsible for one of them. A simple check fire is sufficient to stop us from continuing to fire. Frankly 2 loose shots in hours of play isnt bad, but it isnt zero.

 

3. We are all happy to improve our technique of game play, but if I dont enjoy a game ultimately I wont play. So we need to share knowledge in such a manner that players will want to play. Players should not feel intimidated.

 

4. Yesterday's mission was spoilt by the respawn. I feel that no respawns leads to far tighter play. If we had restarted after losing several players we would have improved our play. It also would have eliminated my grotesque error of forgetting to kneel when arriving back from the respawn area.

 

5. Command structure. I have no problem following a plan, however if I feel there is an alternate, I feel its ok to present the idea if the circumstances permit (ie not being shot at at the time), it can be rejected or accepted by the team leader. If we feels its wrong I will refrain from presenting alternatives.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

Good points Zeno, and I believe we played very well on Sunday, and practice will only make perfect.

 

Re: #5 - Whoever's in charge, if he/she's good, will ask for input after he makes the plan.

 

 

 

[Halli~SPARTA~]

Next Time Finish the mission as a team what good is a mission if ya'll don't finish? :unsure:

 

 

 

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

I should clarify that I do believe we need a Standard Operating Procedure as well, but it needs to be simple and generic.

 

I have no military experience and am a novice at tactical shooters (a novice to online gaming actually). So I will accept the wisdom of those with more experience.

 

This is a game and as such the AI are bound by the rules of programming. Viiiper told me yesterday that the AI have zones of awareness, Obviously the visual zone is conical but the AI are limited to 200 or so metres. A loose shot, particularly a miss, can penetrate the zones of awareness of mulitple patrols. Since you never want to engage more than one patrol at a time and even then only on your terms, I can see the danger of loose shots.

 

A specific deficiency on Sunday was poor use of the map to illustrate where we were going. Before we started we should all have been looking at the map and the lead should have marked on the map the waypoints and if neccesary the targets. This needs to be done after every engagement. We should all know how to do this.

 

Also the lead changed, initially it was Dai-san, after the barn it was Vii, then it reverted back to Dai. Whoever is lead should remain lead until he's taken out.

 

The Barn clearing wasnt coordinated initially.

 

The last town wasnt cleared before elementsof the squad advanced to attack targets at the bridge. Attacking the bridge with a known enemy patrol to our rear is unsound. Dai helped clear the town, but the squad was split. It shouldnt have been.

 

After a couple of hours I notice that the squad cohesion falls apart, this is true for the 2 missions I have participated in. Maybe we should just stop after 2 hours and take a break.

 

 

 

[MUTILATER]

Just so you also are aware High Value Targets change the ROE considerably and now you know this fact taking the officer from a patrol first will lead to chaos from the enemy in more ways than one.

 

The same goes for killing the commander of a tank crew while they are turned out and sunning themselves thinking all is nice and quiet, Tank crews can be sniped very easy and thus give your team a nice fat juicy asset to use.

 

Consider the above facts before opening up on your foe, If your recon guys are doing there job they can take the officer down at the same time the rest of you start your engagement upon a squad. Don't try this on an armor piece as this will lead to death unless you can positively ensure you take the whole crew out within about 2 seconds.

 

Working together as a team will bring the TS talk and ways of going about engagements easier over time as setting standard rules don't work all the time, consider not trying to use any military jargon as you have an international team and we all talk different and comprehend what others say differently as well. Keep your communication as clear and precise in as few words as possible at all times, no need to tell everyone your moving up from point A to B when the whole squad is advancing for example. I was in channel the other night listening to you all for about the first 30 mins, the biggest thing i noticed was people talking while some one else was also speaking thus making it clustered up and indistinguishable what both in fact said ... Then you had to repeat yourself.

 

Another facet i also learned from your TS ... NONE of you use Binoculars ... Get used to them as a scope is not a substitute, also be patient and observe for many minutes before making your advance or someone is going to die very early on in a game.

 

Now this is a huge fault .... So consider what i say here.

 

There was a target in a building and the original observer called it but did not dispose of this target, another said to hold fire, yet others were shooting at other targets moments later. The original observer then decided to move on and then could not see the said enemy target... some of you then asked several times if that building was clear, now this was the worst bit the answer i herd was " I THINK it's clear" and the next person said " I shot the guy on the 1st floor".

 

Well was the building clear ... answer FUKNOSE !! .... you shot one target ... boo hooo , did you consider any more targets in other rooms or behind that building ? ... Maybe there is a gunner in a hall or on a balcony YOU never saw.

Don't consider a building clear until you have checked EVERY room and hallway and balcony or ladder to roof.

 

And don't ever tell another soldier you "Think it's clear" ... It is either CLEAR and 100% checked or it's NOT, no in between.... period. If your unsure, well check it AGAIN, don't just go "Oh fuk it someone else will do it" just because the team is advancing before the area is clean of hostiles and your SURE not half baked about it being under your control. The team that advances too fast before checking all behind them ends up being shot in the back from a lone snipe on a building roof top or window that you never checked.

 

I know I'm being harsh but doing this will ensure you ALL stay alive far longer.

 

Once you get to the finish of a mission and you don't lose anyone, All gather together in a group and take a screen shot, why ? ... because this won't happen often and when you do get to see it and be part of it .. Be Proud and look at your whole team and consider how well you operated TOGETHER.

 

Only then you will have a nice warm fuzzy feeling of being the PERFECT Team.

 

L8R

 

Oh btw ... nice going regardless glad to hear your all progressing better.

[DaiSan]

I can't say I disagree with anything posted so far, which is why I'm pushing so heavily for some SIMPLE SOP's.

 

Who was in charge???? Fecked if I know. The only reason I started trying to sort stuff out was because it was asked several times who was mission commander and there was a big fat TS silence. Do I want to command ArmA games? Hell NO. I have played the sum total of 3 (count them 3) ArmA Co-Op missions and only played ArmA about 7 times in total so I don't even feel I'm in a position to give orders.

 

I was under the impression that there was going to be pre planning on the Co-Op missions before we even hit the server. Roles assigned etc.

 

I spend probably 30-40% of my time looking at the map and tbh this is a habit more people should get into in my opinion.

 

Zeno, I think I know the event you are talking about regarding alternative plans and I for one think any alternatives should at least be offered to command for consideration. I apologise if I appeared offhand or bossy but tbh trying to organise that engagement on the bridge was turning into a nightmare.

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

No-one who played on sunday has a lot of experience. So we'll muddle along helping each other out. In reality you guys with OGR experience are the better candidates for leadership roles. However we should probably take turns so as not to burden the same people all the time. I can use the excel rand function to choose a player. But if no-one puts their hand up next time I will take lead.

 

On the whole the problem with AAR's is they focus on the negative. Overall the game was well executed. Good effort, could do better as all my teachers used to say.

 

Re the Bridge, I was lucky you asked me to cover the right flank, mind you maybe i should have turned when everyone to my left copt it, lol.

 

PS

A final thought, I think it may be better to make notes after the mission and just chat about the areas of weakness, what do you guys think.

[Durka-Durka~SPARTA~]

I like the forum option when talking about the mission, because it's there for record and not everyone can be on at the same time.

 

I'm going to be out of town for a week, but next week, if anyone wants to roll with me as we take out a patrol or two, I'll be glad to be on.

[Zeno~SPARTA~]

Have a good trip and no worries for the forum debrief.

[Zebb]

Away working nights until Monday, good luck with the next mission guys.